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	<title>Comments on: I Can&#8217;t Make Educational History - But We Can: &#8220;Networked Learning&#8221; Class Update</title>
	<atom:link href="http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/</link>
	<description>. . . and beyond "schooliness"          -           notes of a 20th c. teaching drop-out</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 15:54:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Post #3 for my Summer CI 401 class &#171; Cycling Through Ed Tech</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-4078</link>
		<dc:creator>Post #3 for my Summer CI 401 class &#171; Cycling Through Ed Tech</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 14:40:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-4078</guid>
		<description>[...] Clay Burell [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Clay Burell [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Edupunk? at Students 2.0</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-4048</link>
		<dc:creator>Edupunk? at Students 2.0</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2008 11:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-4048</guid>
		<description>[...] Classroom is a great example of online DIY education, and not to mention Clay Burell&#8217;s Personal Learning Network classroom. Packaging us up into one little label isn&#8217;t [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Classroom is a great example of online DIY education, and not to mention Clay Burell&#8217;s Personal Learning Network classroom. Packaging us up into one little label isn&#8217;t [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Clay Burell</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1903</link>
		<dc:creator>Clay Burell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 11:23:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1903</guid>
		<description>@SCOTT: Borrow away, friend.  (And let me confess I have only read &lt;i&gt;about&lt;/i&gt; that manifesto, and have only the foggiest notion of what it is. Link?
As for your "two futures for two types of student" idea, and your suggestion that it's up to the student to choose the original path or the robotic sheep path (the worker bee, whatever) - that touches on the most depressing aspect of teaching: we don't get to choose our students.  And a teacher is only good when his/her students are. I wonder how many students of Socrates or Buddha were a waste of those teachers' energy? 
But I also love the note of optimism in your final metaphor: plant the seeds, and realize the teacher may never know if they sprout and grow - because it may take years.  I told my students today (for the tenth time, because unfamiliar truths have to be repeated until they sink in) they might not realize the value of the skills they learn this semester only when they've long left me and gone to college.  And that's true.

@SUZIE:  Suzie, I'm going crazy waiting for your book to arrive.  If the ideas in it are of the calibre of the ideas in your comment, I'm in for quite a bit of inspiration.  But you have inspired me so much already since our interview last summer.  I'll stop there, because your comment speaks for itself.  Social entrepreneurialism is something I'm going to have to remember when I teach a similar class next year. Beautiful idea.

@DIANE: I didn't mean to suggest that &lt;i&gt;all&lt;/i&gt; who chose not to take the students into their network had issues with human  relationships with them.  I totally respect anybody's decisions regarding how they design their own (adult) PLN.  It was a few comments from people who specifically acknowledged they had issues with it that I found interesting.  

Again (and Dean talks about this in an upcoming podcast) - this networked learning must be &lt;i&gt;natural&lt;/i&gt; for it to work. And that means relationships have to form out of shared interest.

As for the reciprocity and inclusion of the edu-Twitterverse (ug), it's an interesting issue - and really just a variation of the good-old-boy/girl network of the blogosphere, isn't it?  Which is itself an extension of the cliques of the office or schoolhouse. I don't get it either. 
But I think I'm learning that the more you give, the more connections you get.  

Thanks all, for the extensions and learnings, as usual.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@SCOTT: Borrow away, friend.  (And let me confess I have only read <i>about</i> that manifesto, and have only the foggiest notion of what it is. Link?<br />
As for your &#8220;two futures for two types of student&#8221; idea, and your suggestion that it&#8217;s up to the student to choose the original path or the robotic sheep path (the worker bee, whatever) - that touches on the most depressing aspect of teaching: we don&#8217;t get to choose our students.  And a teacher is only good when his/her students are. I wonder how many students of Socrates or Buddha were a waste of those teachers&#8217; energy?<br />
But I also love the note of optimism in your final metaphor: plant the seeds, and realize the teacher may never know if they sprout and grow - because it may take years.  I told my students today (for the tenth time, because unfamiliar truths have to be repeated until they sink in) they might not realize the value of the skills they learn this semester only when they&#8217;ve long left me and gone to college.  And that&#8217;s true.</p>
<p>@SUZIE:  Suzie, I&#8217;m going crazy waiting for your book to arrive.  If the ideas in it are of the calibre of the ideas in your comment, I&#8217;m in for quite a bit of inspiration.  But you have inspired me so much already since our interview last summer.  I&#8217;ll stop there, because your comment speaks for itself.  Social entrepreneurialism is something I&#8217;m going to have to remember when I teach a similar class next year. Beautiful idea.</p>
<p>@DIANE: I didn&#8217;t mean to suggest that <i>all</i> who chose not to take the students into their network had issues with human  relationships with them.  I totally respect anybody&#8217;s decisions regarding how they design their own (adult) PLN.  It was a few comments from people who specifically acknowledged they had issues with it that I found interesting.  </p>
<p>Again (and Dean talks about this in an upcoming podcast) - this networked learning must be <i>natural</i> for it to work. And that means relationships have to form out of shared interest.</p>
<p>As for the reciprocity and inclusion of the edu-Twitterverse (ug), it&#8217;s an interesting issue - and really just a variation of the good-old-boy/girl network of the blogosphere, isn&#8217;t it?  Which is itself an extension of the cliques of the office or schoolhouse. I don&#8217;t get it either.<br />
But I think I&#8217;m learning that the more you give, the more connections you get.  </p>
<p>Thanks all, for the extensions and learnings, as usual.</p>
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		<title>By: Clay Burell</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1901</link>
		<dc:creator>Clay Burell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:59:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1901</guid>
		<description>Stephanie, it's so nice to see you here.  It's even nicer to have you in the class. Like I told you there, you're a natural.  This class can't push education forward without you, either.  
And the nice thing about that world that is interested is, they're all nice people, they all understand that this is still education for you, and so they don't expect you to seem like you "know it all" (and if you notice, most of us who write on our own weblogs know we don't know it all, either.  Anybody who thinks that they know it all really knows very &lt;i&gt;little&lt;/i&gt; at all.
Thanks for coming by. You're always welcome to comment here. Conversations in these comment threads are where I get many ideas, and learn and improve.
And also have fun :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stephanie, it&#8217;s so nice to see you here.  It&#8217;s even nicer to have you in the class. Like I told you there, you&#8217;re a natural.  This class can&#8217;t push education forward without you, either.<br />
And the nice thing about that world that is interested is, they&#8217;re all nice people, they all understand that this is still education for you, and so they don&#8217;t expect you to seem like you &#8220;know it all&#8221; (and if you notice, most of us who write on our own weblogs know we don&#8217;t know it all, either.  Anybody who thinks that they know it all really knows very <i>little</i> at all.<br />
Thanks for coming by. You&#8217;re always welcome to comment here. Conversations in these comment threads are where I get many ideas, and learn and improve.<br />
And also have fun <img src='http://beyond-school.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Stephanie</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1896</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephanie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 08:57:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1896</guid>
		<description>I knew since the beginning that the PLN class that is going to be different than any other classes that I've taken so far, but I didn't know it would mean so much to other educators around the world.  I had no idea how much other people were interested in our projects until now. 

In the beginning, like I do in all the other classes, I tried to keep up with my homework and classwork, which turned out to be a great thing because now I know what this is all about.  I was confused with the projects at first, but now I do believe that our class can add something to the 'educational world'.  I never thought of doing these type of stuff at school because school has always been.. just school; it's all the same around the world.  However, breaking the general idea of school and learning from variety of sources other than just teachers really is something different and quite interesting.  Talking and asking people from the other side of the globe, chatting through skype in class...These aspects prove that there's so much to learn "beyond school" (i wondered why you often say BEYOND school, and now i get i :))</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I knew since the beginning that the PLN class that is going to be different than any other classes that I&#8217;ve taken so far, but I didn&#8217;t know it would mean so much to other educators around the world.  I had no idea how much other people were interested in our projects until now. </p>
<p>In the beginning, like I do in all the other classes, I tried to keep up with my homework and classwork, which turned out to be a great thing because now I know what this is all about.  I was confused with the projects at first, but now I do believe that our class can add something to the &#8216;educational world&#8217;.  I never thought of doing these type of stuff at school because school has always been.. just school; it&#8217;s all the same around the world.  However, breaking the general idea of school and learning from variety of sources other than just teachers really is something different and quite interesting.  Talking and asking people from the other side of the globe, chatting through skype in class&#8230;These aspects prove that there&#8217;s so much to learn &#8220;beyond school&#8221; (i wondered why you often say BEYOND school, and now i get i :))</p>
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		<title>By: &#187; What is &#8220;Sustainably Digital?&#8221; Sustainably Digital</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1875</link>
		<dc:creator>&#187; What is &#8220;Sustainably Digital?&#8221; Sustainably Digital</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 02:25:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1875</guid>
		<description>[...] I Can&#8217;t Make Educational History- But We Can (from Beyond-School) : The class described might be a little beyond my technological means (it&#8217;s a 1:1 school), but I&#8217;m constantly impressed with the things Clay Burell is attempting with his students. My hope is that efforts like his will show the power of full, fearless integration. We need more positive examples like this to convince the naysayers.   addthis_url = 'http%3A%2F%2Fsustainablydigital.edublogs.org%2F2008%2F01%2F29%2Fwhat-is-sustainably-digital%2F'; addthis_title = 'What+is+%26%238220%3BSustainably+Digital%3F%26%238221%3B'; addthis_pub = ''; [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] I Can&#8217;t Make Educational History- But We Can (from Beyond-School) : The class described might be a little beyond my technological means (it&#8217;s a 1:1 school), but I&#8217;m constantly impressed with the things Clay Burell is attempting with his students. My hope is that efforts like his will show the power of full, fearless integration. We need more positive examples like this to convince the naysayers.   addthis_url = &#8216;http%3A%2F%2Fsustainablydigital.edublogs.org%2F2008%2F01%2F29%2Fwhat-is-sustainably-digital%2F&#8217;; addthis_title = &#8216;What+is+%26%238220%3BSustainably+Digital%3F%26%238221%3B&#8217;; addthis_pub = &#8221;; [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Ideas and Thoughts from an EdTech &#187; Blog Archive &#187; What&#8217;s for Supper?</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1874</link>
		<dc:creator>Ideas and Thoughts from an EdTech &#187; Blog Archive &#187; What&#8217;s for Supper?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 01:56:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1874</guid>
		<description>[...] old and me. Coming up with meal ideas can be tough. I posted this playful remark on twitter (see Clay&#8217;s description of how he views twitter) and John Pederson went ahead and created this&#160; and then sat back and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] old and me. Coming up with meal ideas can be tough. I posted this playful remark on twitter (see Clay&#8217;s description of how he views twitter) and John Pederson went ahead and created this&nbsp; and then sat back and [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Diane Quirk</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1873</link>
		<dc:creator>Diane Quirk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 00:55:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1873</guid>
		<description>"there’s a curious reluctance on the part of some adults, it seems, to welcome adolescents into their networks because of their “student” status."
Nah...that's not it...I work with elementary and I'm not sure what I'd have to offer.  And...truthfully...I can't seem to get into the whole Twitter network thing.  I've tried it...asked questions...posted updates and only once have I gotten any sort of response --so right now, tonight, when I'm tired after battling insane changes going on around me - I'm just not a fan (no offense to anyone!).

&lt;em&gt;Diane Quirk's last blog post..&lt;a href='http://quirkytech.blogspot.com/2008/01/focusing-on-connection.html' rel="nofollow"&gt;Focusing on Connections&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;there’s a curious reluctance on the part of some adults, it seems, to welcome adolescents into their networks because of their “student” status.&#8221;<br />
Nah&#8230;that&#8217;s not it&#8230;I work with elementary and I&#8217;m not sure what I&#8217;d have to offer.  And&#8230;truthfully&#8230;I can&#8217;t seem to get into the whole Twitter network thing.  I&#8217;ve tried it&#8230;asked questions&#8230;posted updates and only once have I gotten any sort of response &#8211;so right now, tonight, when I&#8217;m tired after battling insane changes going on around me - I&#8217;m just not a fan (no offense to anyone!).</p>
<p><em>Diane Quirk&#8217;s last blog post..<a href='http://quirkytech.blogspot.com/2008/01/focusing-on-connection.html' rel="nofollow">Focusing on Connections</a></em></p>
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		<title>By: Suzie Boss</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1869</link>
		<dc:creator>Suzie Boss</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 22:57:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1869</guid>
		<description>Clay,
Can't wait to see where this idea leads. One prediction: those adult "mentors" in your digital guild may wind up learning just as much as their young proteges. For the past few years, I've been involved with an informal learning program where teen girls become change-makers in their own communities. The girls decide which local problem to tackle, which sustainable solution to apply, and which adults to invite to help them. (All the participants are from economically distressed, rural communities, so these are not kids of privileged backgrounds.) To get them ready for this ambitious program, we teach teens about social entrepreneurship--a new concept for most adults, but a great strategy for making good ideas last. The girls warm up quickly to the idea of building a personal network.  For most of them, networking comes as naturally as breathing. When they have a real need to know, they don't hesitate to track down expert sources. And when they're enthusiastic about their projects, adults can't help but lend support. 
Good luck with your open school network!
Cheers,
Suzie

&lt;em&gt;Suzie Boss's last blog post..&lt;a href='http://reinventingpbl.blogspot.com/2008/01/enough-sugar-in-your-educational.html' rel="nofollow"&gt;Enough Sugar in Your Educational Technology Diet?&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clay,<br />
Can&#8217;t wait to see where this idea leads. One prediction: those adult &#8220;mentors&#8221; in your digital guild may wind up learning just as much as their young proteges. For the past few years, I&#8217;ve been involved with an informal learning program where teen girls become change-makers in their own communities. The girls decide which local problem to tackle, which sustainable solution to apply, and which adults to invite to help them. (All the participants are from economically distressed, rural communities, so these are not kids of privileged backgrounds.) To get them ready for this ambitious program, we teach teens about social entrepreneurship&#8211;a new concept for most adults, but a great strategy for making good ideas last. The girls warm up quickly to the idea of building a personal network.  For most of them, networking comes as naturally as breathing. When they have a real need to know, they don&#8217;t hesitate to track down expert sources. And when they&#8217;re enthusiastic about their projects, adults can&#8217;t help but lend support.<br />
Good luck with your open school network!<br />
Cheers,<br />
Suzie</p>
<p><em>Suzie Boss&#8217;s last blog post..<a href='http://reinventingpbl.blogspot.com/2008/01/enough-sugar-in-your-educational.html' rel="nofollow">Enough Sugar in Your Educational Technology Diet?</a></em></p>
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		<title>By: Scott Schwister</title>
		<link>http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1867</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Schwister</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 22:09:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beyond-school.org/2008/01/29/i-cant-make-educational-history-but-we-can-networked-learning-class-update/#comment-1867</guid>
		<description>@Clay: I gotta say you've whipped up a fine networked learning version of the Future of Learning Manifesto. And, at the risk of completely hitching a ride on your fast-moving coat-tails, I think its message is eminently  translatable into a Future of Professional Development Manifesto. Can I borrow shamelessly? 

@Barry: Your question, and Clay's response, triggers a thought I keep having: the prospect that we're providing two distinct educational experiences for different student populations, preparing them for radically different futures. Creative vs. factory. An opt-in elective experience probably isn't the establishment's ideal vis-a-vis student preparation---which is exactly why Clay should keep pounding gleefully away at it. Those opt-in students may be able to craft much more creative, imaginative, human-property-valuable futures than dispassionate students who remain in the routinized comfort-bubble, and there are businesses out there that crave the opt-in mentality, and more that will be started up in a few years by those same students. Of course, there are still more businesses and institutions that are scared stiff at the prospect of mold-breakers. Some would argue that the world needs both brands, both future-streams. I'm not sure I'm one of them. But there's that pesky sticking point that keeps coming up: everything revolves around the student's drive to learn. When it's absent or just hiding shyly in the woods, we know coercive crashing around and noisemaking won't do much good. Diane's approach may be best: plant the seeds with fearless disregard for the odds.

&lt;em&gt;Scott Schwister's last blog post..&lt;a href='http://higheredison.typepad.com/higheredison/2008/01/twitku-tuesday.html' rel="nofollow"&gt;twitku tuesday contest inaugural edition now open&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Clay: I gotta say you&#8217;ve whipped up a fine networked learning version of the Future of Learning Manifesto. And, at the risk of completely hitching a ride on your fast-moving coat-tails, I think its message is eminently  translatable into a Future of Professional Development Manifesto. Can I borrow shamelessly? </p>
<p>@Barry: Your question, and Clay&#8217;s response, triggers a thought I keep having: the prospect that we&#8217;re providing two distinct educational experiences for different student populations, preparing them for radically different futures. Creative vs. factory. An opt-in elective experience probably isn&#8217;t the establishment&#8217;s ideal vis-a-vis student preparation&#8212;which is exactly why Clay should keep pounding gleefully away at it. Those opt-in students may be able to craft much more creative, imaginative, human-property-valuable futures than dispassionate students who remain in the routinized comfort-bubble, and there are businesses out there that crave the opt-in mentality, and more that will be started up in a few years by those same students. Of course, there are still more businesses and institutions that are scared stiff at the prospect of mold-breakers. Some would argue that the world needs both brands, both future-streams. I&#8217;m not sure I&#8217;m one of them. But there&#8217;s that pesky sticking point that keeps coming up: everything revolves around the student&#8217;s drive to learn. When it&#8217;s absent or just hiding shyly in the woods, we know coercive crashing around and noisemaking won&#8217;t do much good. Diane&#8217;s approach may be best: plant the seeds with fearless disregard for the odds.</p>
<p><em>Scott Schwister&#8217;s last blog post..<a href='http://higheredison.typepad.com/higheredison/2008/01/twitku-tuesday.html' rel="nofollow">twitku tuesday contest inaugural edition now open</a></em></p>
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